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highway16ny Rookie Author Long Island Posts:1 Points:245 Joined:Mar 2012	Message Posted: Mar 18, 2012 1:48:41 PM Ignore highway16ny Report Abuse when idling your car it burns less gas in neutral than when in gear when a light has just turned red shut off engine you will save a lot of gas [Edited by: highway16ny at 3/18/2012 2:55:12 PM EST]

highway16ny

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Long Island

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Message Posted: Mar 18, 2012 1:48:41 PM

Ignore highway16ny Report Abuse

when idling your car it burns less gas in neutral than when in gear when a light has just turned red shut off engine you will save a lot of gas

[Edited by: highway16ny at 3/18/2012 2:55:12 PM EST]

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GBHUGVA Champion Author Virginia Beach Posts:4,697 Points:789,160 Joined:Mar 2009	Message Posted: Mar 24, 2012 5:45:15 PM Ignore GBHUGVA Report Abuse A NICE USED FORD Escape/MERCURY Mariner/MAZDA Tribute HYBRID IS THE WAY TO GO!
kxy4fw Champion Author Denver Posts:1,226 Points:275,355 Joined:Nov 2011	Message Posted: Mar 24, 2012 8:58:05 AM Ignore kxy4fw Report Abuse Thx
pinbuster2005 Champion Author New Hampshire Posts:5,210 Points:1,524,650 Joined:Oct 2005	Message Posted: Mar 24, 2012 4:15:40 AM Ignore pinbuster2005 Report Abuse Hotrod10 - look at the topic it says "idling" not idling at red lights so with the topic as open as that everything can be discussed.
GBHUGVA Champion Author Virginia Beach Posts:4,697 Points:789,160 Joined:Mar 2009	Message Posted: Mar 23, 2012 9:08:29 PM Ignore GBHUGVA Report Abuse Is idle less the same as blow through that stop sign or red light? :D
HotRod10 Champion Author Wyoming Posts:2,325 Points:41,230 Joined:Oct 2006	Message Posted: Mar 23, 2012 3:10:37 PM Ignore HotRod10 Report Abuse "Any idling uses gas without the benefit of miles, bad!" Yep, but shortening the life of your engine and wearing out the starter is also bad. "How often folks want to start up their engines is their business." This is a discussion forum; everything discussed here could fall under the category of someone else's business, but most of us are participating in order learn and maybe teach, or at least to examine other points of view. The subject of the OP was the pros and cons of shifting into neutral or turning the engine off at red lights. I don't think it's a good idea to do either, and I stated my reasons for that point of view. "HotRod..., are you a moderator that has to police what is discussed?" Nope, just trying to stay on topic. Maybe you should chill out.
StArrow68 Champion Author Oakland Posts:3,392 Points:1,387,440 Joined:Apr 2003	Message Posted: Mar 23, 2012 1:54:51 PM Ignore StArrow68 Report Abuse HotRod..., are you a moderator that has to police what is discussed? Chill out! Any idling uses gas without the benefit of miles, bad! How often folks want to start up their engines is their business.
briandbec Champion Author Tucson Posts:4,364 Points:522,970 Joined:Aug 2011	Message Posted: Mar 23, 2012 1:53:28 PM Ignore briandbec Report Abuse GBHUGVA Stop/start is rolling out, but you can't retrofit it. As much as Americans idle needlessly, it is a good application of technology. Me, I just idle less.
GBHUGVA Champion Author Virginia Beach Posts:4,697 Points:789,160 Joined:Mar 2009	Message Posted: Mar 23, 2012 12:39:39 PM Ignore GBHUGVA Report Abuse The Hybrid gas engine on my Ford stops at all stops and some coasting too, once it is warmed up. So all gas engines could use this technology and in my opinion should, this would save alot of gas.
HotRod10 Champion Author Wyoming Posts:2,325 Points:41,230 Joined:Oct 2006	Message Posted: Mar 23, 2012 12:22:06 PM Ignore HotRod10 Report Abuse A hybrid is made to stop and restart the gas engine over and over, and even it probably doesn't restart the gas engine every stop, but runs on electric in stop and go traffic, right? Gas-only vehicles are not made to do that.
GBHUGVA Champion Author Virginia Beach Posts:4,697 Points:789,160 Joined:Mar 2009	Message Posted: Mar 23, 2012 11:00:59 AM Ignore GBHUGVA Report Abuse My Ford Hybrid turns off automatically, it should be required of all new cars, would save lots of fuel.
HotRod10 Champion Author Wyoming Posts:2,325 Points:41,230 Joined:Oct 2006	Message Posted: Mar 23, 2012 8:56:51 AM Ignore HotRod10 Report Abuse No pinbuster, the subject was narrowly defined as to whether or not it takes more gas to idle in gear than in neutral. Idling in park to warm the car is completely off the subject and has been beaten to death in several other threads. Whether to idle in gear or shift into neutral at the drive-thru is much the same as at a red light, since the time in one position at the drive-thru is similar to the time stopped at a red light. However, discussion of going or not going to the drive-thru is off-topic for this thread, and likewise has been beaten to death elsewhere.
pinbuster2005 Champion Author New Hampshire Posts:5,210 Points:1,524,650 Joined:Oct 2005	Message Posted: Mar 22, 2012 4:36:56 PM Ignore pinbuster2005 Report Abuse hotrod10 - The subject is idling period. Just because the person that started this thread asked about idling at a red light the other types of idling I mentioned are worth disscussing as well because those are the types of idling that use much more gas than when your at a light because your doing it for a longer period of time.
briandbec Champion Author Tucson Posts:4,364 Points:522,970 Joined:Aug 2011	Message Posted: Mar 22, 2012 3:04:39 PM Ignore briandbec Report Abuse "I don't understand why neutral will save more gas when idling. When you're in neutral, engine rpms are higher (3000rpm) than when in gear (1500rpm). Are there any confirmation on this?" forrestj, If you are idling at 3000 rpms, you either need to get your vehicle checked or you have Toyota syndrome. If the mechanic says your car is fine, I suggest you take your foot off the gas when you aren't moving. Thanks to ECUs, MAFs, MAPs and fuel injection, no modern vehicle should idle above 800 rpm in neutral. Back to the 1Xer who made this thread, he is right to an extent. Automatic transmissions have torque converters. Their job is to tackle the problem of how to keep the engine running when the gears in the transmission aren't moving. The converter is an intermediate and not really part of the gear-changing mechanicals of the transmission. It does the work of a clutch, but less efficiently. When the engine is running and the torque converter is NOT locked (happens at a pre-set speed/set of gears controlled by computer) the converter is slipping, meaning that the engine is turning a specific speed, and the shaft on the other side of the converter is turning more slowly (or not at all, when stopped) The torque converter is a pawer parasite, the same way the AC is. When an automatic is in gear and the torque converter is not locked, it will ALWAYS get worse gas mileage than a manual transmission (this assumes the driver is not riding the clutch in the manual, as that will also rob engine power and efficiency). When an automatic transmission is in gear and the vehicle is not moving, the engine will consume more fuel than if it was receiving no resistance from the torque converter. On the flipside, placing your automatic transmission vehicle in neutral whenever stopped will wear down the transmission, so it is probably not a good thing to be changing gears at every stoplight. The best way to save gas is to drive a manual or dual-clutch automated manual (DSG), and to not use fast food drive thrus.
KansasGunman Champion Author Kansas City Posts:21,441 Points:2,104,540 Joined:Oct 2005	Message Posted: Mar 22, 2012 1:25:40 PM Ignore KansasGunman Report Abuse Yet another asinine beat to death topic repeated for the umpteenth time by a drive-by one time posting FNG. [Edited by: KansasGunman at 3/22/2012 2:26:48 PM EST]
HotRod10 Champion Author Wyoming Posts:2,325 Points:41,230 Joined:Oct 2006	Message Posted: Mar 22, 2012 11:47:43 AM Ignore HotRod10 Report Abuse I agree with oilerfan; air/fuel mixture is the same throughout, and with the throttle closed, the amount of air, and therefore fuel, is at least as much in neutral as in drive. A properly working AT should not significantly increase the load on the engine in drive vs neutral, anyway. pinbuster, the subject was idling at red lights; try to stay on topic. [Edited by: HotRod10 at 3/22/2012 12:50:47 PM EST]
forresj Champion Author Wilmington Posts:2,940 Points:569,980 Joined:May 2005	Message Posted: Mar 22, 2012 10:31:05 AM Ignore forresj Report Abuse I don't understand why neutral will save more gas when idling. When you're in neutral, engine rpms are higher (3000rpm) than when in gear (1500rpm). Are there any confirmation on this?
OilerFan Champion Author Tulsa Posts:14,179 Points:2,457,350 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Mar 22, 2012 6:37:45 AM Ignore OilerFan Report Abuse Idling is idling. As long as the rpms are the same, the engine isn't working any harder and you're not burning any more gasoline.
gougedQC Champion Author Montreal Posts:5,140 Points:69,985 Joined:Apr 2008	Message Posted: Mar 22, 2012 6:31:40 AM Ignore gougedQC Report Abuse agree with PIN about the waste..and pollution..of the very unnecessary "warming" the engine on cold days.. but it is an interesting question.. idling in neutral, the rpm are higher, than in gear..but is it because the same amount of fuel is being used which lowers the rpm against the braking resistance...or is slightly more fuel being used.. interesting question... in any case, im usually in neutral coasting to stops anyway...that I know saves gas
pinbuster2005 Champion Author New Hampshire Posts:5,210 Points:1,524,650 Joined:Oct 2005	Message Posted: Mar 22, 2012 3:36:08 AM Ignore pinbuster2005 Report Abuse I can't agree with that. Where I see people waste the most gas idling is the following. 1.) letting it idle for 10-15 mins before getting in it to warm it up in the winter or cool it off in the summer. 2.) Using the drive up window at the fastfood place or bank instead of parking and walking inside. 3.) leaving their automobile idling while they are in a C-store getting a coffee and/or paper or while pumping gas because they're afraid that the interior might get a couple of degrees wormer or cooler (depending on the time of the year) than they like in a couple of min. I've seen people leave their automobile idling while in the grocery store doing their week's shopping.
maxstar Champion Author Chicago Posts:18,675 Points:836,270 Joined:Feb 2011	Message Posted: Mar 20, 2012 6:16:39 PM Ignore maxstar Report Abuse I agree with HotRod10. The idling scheme sounds like a very dangerous practice and and would cause more wear an tear on the car.
rick_evans Champion Author Boston Posts:3,857 Points:1,057,825 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Mar 20, 2012 2:37:22 PM Ignore rick_evans Report Abuse If you drive sensibly instead of like a typical backwards ball cap wearing 19 year old you will mostly avoid red lights and save on starter wear.
HotRod10 Champion Author Wyoming Posts:2,325 Points:41,230 Joined:Oct 2006	Message Posted: Mar 20, 2012 12:54:28 PM Ignore HotRod10 Report Abuse Save a few bucks in gas now, and spend a few thousand later to replace the engine and transmission? No Thanks. Most of the wear in an ICE occurs in the first few seconds after startup when the parts are moving but the oil pressure isn't up, and shifting in and out of gear in an AT will kill it after a while; they're not made to do that. If you're willing to go to that much effort, just get a car with a manual transmission and save more driving and idling.
jimmy544 Champion Author Boston Posts:4,373 Points:680,580 Joined:Feb 2011	Message Posted: Mar 18, 2012 9:06:38 PM Ignore jimmy544 Report Abuse If you are concerned about burning gas idling in gear or not with an automatic trans you should just shut off the engine. Knowing how much your car burns in idle will likely surprise you. One estimate has 10% of all motor fuel burned in the US burned at idle.This is a staggering amount.
Shell91Octane Rookie Author California Posts:16 Points:157,890 Joined:Mar 2011	Message Posted: Mar 18, 2012 7:13:46 PM Ignore Shell91Octane Report Abuse Idling gets 0 MPG obiously but I am curious about this neutral vs drive I will put it to the test.
cheapmonkee Champion Author Portland Posts:30,482 Points:3,198,135 Joined:Jun 2004	Message Posted: Mar 18, 2012 5:18:29 PM Ignore cheapmonkee Report Abuse Yes, I shift to neutral when I am almost to the red light. It works great and lets things cool a little too.